King of Hyrule

I know, this thread is sooo innovative, but try and bear with me, mmk? There are many different theories regarding the Zelda timeline, so feel free to say your opinion on this topic, but I’m going to go on and try to explain how I think it goes.

The Ultimate Timeline

This seems to be the most common tactic used in order to try and “decode” the Zelda storyline. Each game is a distint and unique event that needs its own place on the timeline. What that order is, we have no idea.

The Legend Theory

In a nutshell, this theory states that The Legend of Zelda is a story that is told and re-told many times and is passed down orally from generation to generation, thus causing the many plotholes and tiny details that don’t seem to add up when we try to form one ultimate timeline.

Looking Past Fact and into the Legend

“History is a nightmare from which I am trying to awake.” – James Joyce

For anyone who has read anything by Joseph Campbell, that quote can have some meaning to you. The argument is that in the East, things tend to take on more symbolic meaning, while in the West we have concretized our thought process. If you tell a Christian that Jesus Christ did not really rise from the dead, you are striking them right at the heart, the core of their belief. The main difference between the Western and Eastern religions is that in the East, there is a psychological barrier that keeps you from obtaining the ultimate reality. A psychological process separated you from ‘God’ in the beginning, and a psychological process will help you find your way back to God/duality/nirvana/whatever. In the West, it was the fall from grace, a historical event, that separated us from God (Garden of Eden), it was a historical event that helped show us the way back to God (Christ’s crucifixion), and it will be a historical event that will ultimately reunite us with God (the day of Judgment).

To go back and make a connection, it seems to me that there’s a big difference in how people in the West go about explaining the Zelda timeline from people in the East (Nintendo). We have been trying to piece together the timeline into one coherent unit for who knows how long, while Nintendo comes out and says that they don’t think of it that way. They see it as whenever evil rises (Ganon) over the land (Hyrule), a hero (Link) rises to save it. And they leave it at that. There is no further explanation because there needs to be no further explanation. This idea seems to transcend transcend both the Legend and “Ultimate timeline” theory, yet it is really a combination of both.

The problem for us is that we dwell so much on the tiny details that we fail to see the big picture when it comes to assembling a “timeline”. Does it matter if Ganon looks different in Wind Waker than in Ocarina of Time? Does it matter if Impa is fat in the Oracle games and not in Ocarina? Does it matter if Link’s hair is purple in A Link to the Past and nowhere else? No. It doesn’t matter at all. All of these characters, they are all just symbolic representations of the events/themes that occur. Link is the hero; he looks different in each game because he’s not the same Link even though he is. Link, though he could be a distinct and unique Link in a certain game, is just the representation of the hero; he is an image we can connect to. This goes back to the Joyce quote, we’re obsessed with the history, and it creates a nightmare for us because we can’t peace any of it together in a convincing manner.

Where the two theories meet

“This is but one of the legends that the people speak.” – The Wind Waker

Now this line seems to back up the Legend theory quite a bit, and it does back it up, but we would need to clear some things up at the same time. It’s obvious that not every game is a re-telling of the same story IF you look at them as distinct, unique events. The thing is, you have to look at it both ways. Each game IS a unique event if you look at what the specific details are in each game, yet when viewed on a broader scale, they are very much the same stories re-told.

A legend is a myth, it’s a story. If Wind Waker is but one of the legends, this obviously implies that there are many myths/stories. So, of course, each game/story is a distinct event. Yet when you look at myth on a broader scale, what is revealed is very much the same story, the same archetypes, the same themes are there. Whether you are in the Africa or in a tribe with the Plains Indians or reading the Bible or studying Buddhism, you are getting very much the same story. It all depends on how you interpret it. In the West, we take it literally, in the East, it is psychological. So what we get is not The Legend of Zelda, but A Legend of Zelda. If Zelda is a myth, and it seems that it most certainly is, then there are many stories and many events, but the important parts, the archetypes, these are all the same. So, since Zelda is mythology and mythology is archetypal, the Zelda series, although it may consist of many adventures being told by many different people, IS the same legend re-told.

The Contemporary Setting

What’s happening now is strikingly similar to what happened in the past, except now it’s in a contemporary setting. Nintendo are the ancient storytellers...the differences stem not only from that fact that the adventures are unique, but that Zelda’s storytellers are different each time as well, from the director, to the script writers (Miyamoto by himself, Aonuma directing next, and now, Mitsuhiro Takano for this newest, realistic Zelda). WE are the people being told these stories...we are getting mythology without realizing it, being told that there’s a Link, a Ganon, a Hyrule, all so that we can identify with the theme of Zelda, the archetypal battle of good vs. evil. The actual events may be unique, but the core, which is central to any myth, is the same.

Thoughts?

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kinopio

I used to have the same theory, then Nintendo somewhat ruined it by making Wind Waker such an obvious sequel to Ocarina of Time which itself was a prequel to A Link to the Past (the Seal War). In the end, I still think it doesn't matter much, but I wouldn't like their creativity to be obstucted by something as trivial as trying to patch the plot's leaks.

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nenned

Miyamoto gave a timeline before the release of TWW and the Oracle games. Here it is:

Ocarina
Majora
Legend of Zelda
Adventure of Link
A Link to the Past (yes, it comes AFTER the original Zelda, censorship of the game's origial name "Triforce of the Gods" and a serious translation error by Dan Owsen lead to the belief the game takes place before the original)

Link's Awakenings can come after any of these games.

My guess is that the order for the entire series is:

Ocarina
Majora
TWW
Zelda
Adventure of Link
A Link to the Past
Oracle games (Triforce is completed in ALTTP and the completed Triforce gives Link his quest so it must come after ALTTP)
Link's Awakenings (says Link is returning from a trip of enlightenment. I think the oracle games is that trip)

kinopio

Fixed, I guess you meant Ocarina first. And the Oracle games have Gorons in them if I remember correctly, I don't think gorons exist anymore by WW's era and... What am I doing? See? that's the sh*t I was talking about: I don't care what the timeline is. I still share King of Hyrule's theory.

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nenned

Oops yes. Changes saved

And maybe the TriForce brought the Gorons back to life??

kinopio

That would be the crystal dragon balls...

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Code_Link

"Serious translation error"? Oooooh, I'm a huge Zelda fan, but do not know about this. Do tell!

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nenned

The game was called "Triforce of the Gods" in Japan. But in the US, when Nintendo was in censorship mode, they didn't want the word "God" or "God" in their titles. The name was changed to A Link to the Past, meaning the Link and events in ALTTP are linked to the Link and events of the previous games (LOZ & AOL, and later OOT). Dan Owsen, in charge of translating Zelda games at the time, thought the title meant that the Link and events in ALTTP take place before the original games. In a later interview with Nintendo Power (who are just at fault for this timeline confusion by coming up with the rediculous theory of one Link traveling through time) said to ignore the description on the back of ALTTP's box that says the game takes before the NES Zeldas.

nenned

Hyrule is flooded in TWW and presumably the Gorons went with it. However, the Oracle games don't take place in Hyrule but in the lands of Holodrum and Labrynia. Also, we don't even know if those land actually exist or were created by the TriForce for Link's test.

Code_Link

Oooooh, nice info nenned, thanks.

By the way, I did see a couple of Gorons in Wind Waker. Survivors maybe?

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Batist

all those pics are from wind waker






notice the window characters are??

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kajiaisu

I wish the first game in the timeline was Links Awakening When his ship breaks apart during the storm and he floats to the island...it would really make you think....where did the original Link come from, who is he actually, and his past. That would of been a great beginning to the story.

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Keazu

There were Gorons in TWW, but they are now known as the "salesmen."



Hey, am I the only one who finds it strange that the Zora evolved into the Rito when there was now so much water?

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Brawl- 2320-5856-7241

King of Hyrule

Well, I don't remember that. However, even if that's true, right before WW was out and after the Oracle games were released, I remember Aonuma coming out and saying that both he and Miyamoto believed in the whole 'hero rising to save the land" idea for each game. Then we have hints in WW, AND you bring up Miyamoto talking about LttP, when he has also said before that LttP is the LAST Zelda in the series. Even when the creator tries to piece it together he has a hard time making sense of it. We're still left fending for ourselves, so I'm going by their most current explanation (the hero). Obviously some games are connected, I don't think it goes against the idea of a myth though. Some myths are connected, doesn't mean they aren't myth.

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kinopio

You're right Keazu (and code_link), I totally forgot the salesmen were gorons.

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nenned

Yeah, and??

fhqwhgads

in the beginning of WW it talks about the legend of the hero doens't it. i just assumed that the link from one Zelda title wasn't the same fella from any other title really, but that Link is just an ideal kinda...i dunno how to say what i mean, but i think its basically what some others have already said, so i'll shut up

Batist

well, it just proves WW is after OOT and MM

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Knightblade

well I don't know how you will put WW before LOZ. but we may find out with Zelda 2005